Internet Info 1994 March/Internet Info CD-ROM (Walnut Creek) (March 1994).iso/answers/rec/music/alternative-faq/part1

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From: Joshua John Buergel <[e-mail]>
Newsgroups: rec.music.info,alt.answers,rec.answers,news.answers,alt.music.alternative
Subject: FAQ: alt.music.alternative Frequently Asked Questions part one of two
Date: Thu,  7 Apr 1994 22:24:07 -0400
Organization: Junior, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA
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Summary: This posting is the first part a document that contains some frequently asked questions and answers relvant to alt.music.alternative.  It also contains some posting guidlines and should be read by anyone who wishes to post to alt.music.alternative.
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Archive-name: music/alternative-faq/part1
Last-modified:  1994/04/07

Well, I'm back.  I've been on a Usenet music hiatus for a while now.
Basically, I haven't read this newsgroup (or resubbed to any mailing
lists) since Christmas break.  That's not to say I haven't been buying
music.  I just haven't been reading anything on the net about music.  At
any rate, here is the FAQ I wrote a long time ago.  I've updated one or
two things, nuked one or two things, and added one or two things.  This
fails to interest me much any more, but if you have comments, send 'em
to [e-mail] and I'll get around to them.  Eventually.

"There are no stupid questions, just stupid people."
   -The Mr. T Experience, "Master of the Situation"

Presenting the ALT.MUSIC.ALTERNATIVE Frequently Asked Questions list!

Message One:
I.  Introduction to alt.music.alternative or "Just what the heck IS all
of this?"
II.  Frequently asked questions or "I just discovered these two tracks
on my Nine Inch Nails CD..."

Message Two:
III.  Basic Usenet ettiquette or "You too can waste hundreds, if not
thousands of dollars!"
IV.  Mailing lists or "Does anyone have the address of my clue?"
V.  FTP or "Dave Datta is your pal!"

--==|| Part I ||==--

INTRODUCTION

    Sometime in early 1992, some enterprising soul decided that there was a
void in Usenet.  After braving the firestorm on rec.music.misc, that
brave soul decided to create a brand new group:  alt.music.alternative.

    This new newsgroup was to be dedicated to discussion of
"alternative" music.  The folks who read rec.music.misc correctly
predicted flamewars about the definition of alternative.  Every now and
again, somebody forgets to log out of their terminal or is overwhelmed
with their own cleverness and decides to post some sort of message
declaring "That's not alternative!"  Of course people invariably take
this bait and a flamewar ensues.  That's not what this newsgroup is
for...it would be called alt.music.flame if it were for that.

    So what is this group for?  What IS alternative music?  That's a
pretty good question, and it probably is the most frequently asked
question in this newsgroup.  Unfortunately, neither I nor anyone else
can really answer this question.  In a broad sense, alternative is music
that is an alternative to standard mainstream music.  Instead of
discussing Madonna we would be ideally discussing Masonna.  This
defination is very loose, however, since it excludes the many acts that
once had a very limited following and now have become very popular.  The
best example of this phenomenon in my mind is R.E.M.  Are they
alternative?

    Many would say, "No!  What are you, some sort of booger-head?"
Others might say, "Of course!  Just because they are popular doesn't
mean they've necessarily changed at all!"  Still yet others might say,
"Who cares?  Pass the salt."  My take on the matter is that such bands
as R.E.M., Nirvana and other groups who have become extraordinarily
popular these days should still be discussed.  Any flamewars trying to
get people to stop posting about these bands would invariably waste a
hundred times more bandwidth than the original discussion would have
taken.  Live and let live.  Just discuss the music, and this will become
a better newsgroup.

    Mark Cornick, former co-moderater of the indie list (see section IV) has
the following to say:

"Louis Armstrong was once asked 'what is jazz?' He replied 'If you
have to ask the question, you will never know the answer.' Alternative
is in your own mind. So if you think it's alternative, it probably is,
and if it isn't people will happily flame you. C'mon folks, you know
what's alternative and what's not, and if you don't, turn on your
local college radio station or (gasp) 120 Minutes and maybe you'll
find out."

    I can agree with this.  The upshot of this section is that this
newsgroup is for discussion of alternative MUSIC.  This means that
everything from "punk" to "grunge" to "industrial" to "techno" to
"noise" to "post punk" to "whatever it is they are calling alternative
these days" is a valid topic for discussion.  It is not for a discussion
of how cool you think you are.  It is not for a discussion about how
obnoxious the VJ of "Alternative Nation" is.  It is not for a discussion
of WHAT alternative music is.  Just discuss the music you enjoy, and you
might find others out there with similar tastes.  I know I have.

--==|| Part II ||==--

Frequently Asked Questions

Q:  I bought Nine Inch Nails' CD _Broken_ the other day, and I
discovered that there are two bonus tracks at the end of the CD?  Holy
cow!  Any idea what these are called?

A:  Well, you're not the first to discover this.  There are indeed two
bonus tracks on _Broken_.  The first is a cover of an Adam and the Ants
song entitled "Physical (You're So)" and the second is a cover of a
Pigface song, "Suck".  The latter was actually co-written by Trent
Reznor and he helped perform it with Pigface on _Gub_, but it is still
originally a Pigface song.  The version included on _Broken_ is actually
significantly different than the one on _Gub_.

Q:  Hey, man, I can't find NIN's _Fixed_ ANYWHERE!  What the heck?

A:  It's limited edition.  After an original run, Interscope
discontinued the single.  Some reports seem to indicate that Interscope
stopped printing _Fixed_ so that it would not cut into sales of
_Broken_.  These same reports state that _Fixed_ will be reissued after
sales of _Broken_ cool off.  At any rate, there are still a few copies
of _Fixed_ floating around.  In addition, the single is still in print
oversees and is available as an import.  All is not lost.

Q:  What are the official NIN releases, as long as I'm bugging you?  And
what is this "Halo" business?

A:  The "Halo" designation goes on every official NIN release.  Halo 1
is the "Down In It" 12" (later reissued on CD), Halo 2 is _Pretty Hate
Machine_, Halo 3 is the "Head Like A Hole" single, Halo 4 is the "Sin"
single, Halo 5 is _Broken_ and Halo 6 is _Fixed_.  There is a bootleg CD
containing "Supernaut" and "Suck" that is marked "Halo 00", but this is
NOT an official release.  The Halo designation was added in a totally
spurious attempt to make it look official.

    Since the above paragraph has been written, two new "Halo" releases
have surfaced.  A single for "March of the Pigs" is Halo 7 and the album
_The Downward Spiral_ is Halo 8.  I'll probably stop updating this little
discography thing at this point, but if you want a complete discography,
one is likely available at the musical archives at cs.uwp.edu (see part
V).

Q:  Woah.  After a bunch of silence there is another track on Nirvana's
_Nevermind_!  What is up with this?

A:  It's called "Endless Nameless" and was included on all CDs of
_Nevermind_ after the very first run.  If you have one of these first
50,000 CDs, you can still get the track by purchasing the single for
"Come As You Are" which was released in England.  As for other
countries, I'm not certain if the track was included or not.

Q:  Is Eddie Vedder dead?

A:  Nope.  For that matter, Anthony Keidis does not have AIDS nor does
Flea.  Dick Vaughn, however, is dead.

Q:  Man, you're not alternative.  I've got one of only three copies of
Flaccid Penile Implant's 7" "Fartstorm" b/w "Burning Rectal Hell" and
the other two were eaten by my neighbor's Rottweiler.

A:  Are you always this obnoxious, or just when I put words in your
mouth?  Anyway, check your attitude at the door, friend.
Alt.music.alternative is not the sort of place for these sorts of
infantile comments.  Besides, there were four of those made...I ought to
know, I made them.

Q:  Is Eddie Vedder dead yet?

A:  Nope, not yet.

Q:  You sure?

A:  Quite.

Q:  So, what's the deal with the new Pearl Jam album?  What is it called?

A:  Pearl Jam decided, at the last minute, to change the name of the
album from _Five Against One_ to _Vs._.  They decided after the album
had started to go through the first pressing, so instead of trashing the
entire first run they decided to go ahead and release them.  The album
was also issued in two forms, a digi-pak and a normal jewel box.  I'm
afraid I don't know how rare any of these editions are, but I'm certain
one could say "not rare at all" and be correct.

Q:  I just heard that the Pixies have broken up!  Is that true?

A:  Yes, it is true.  Black Francis is now going under the name Frank
Black and has a solo album out on 4AD (Electra here in the US) entitled
_Frank Black_.  Kim Deal is devoting her time to the Breeders, and they
have since released _Last Splash_ which is making quite the splash in
alt.music.alternative.  Dave Lovering somehow landed
in Nitzer Ebb, go figure.  In addition, he is currently touring with
Cracker, meaning that he might not be with Nitzer Ebb after all and
might have (much more sensibly) decided to play with Cracker for a
while.  Anybody with more information on Lovering is encouraged to mail
me.  Finally, Joey Santiago contributed some guitar on Frank Black's
album.  What he is doing besides that is unknown to me, although reports
seem to indicate he will be playing with Mr. Black for a while.
    Incidentally, since the demise of Rough Trade, _Come On Pilgrim_ and
_Surfer Rosa_ are now out on separate CDs, so if you find the
combination CD used, snap it up so record company weasels don't make any
money off of this bum deal.

Q:  Hey, anybody have the lyrics to "Spewmatic" by Spam Enema?

A:  If anybody on the net has the lyrics has the lyrics to any song,
odds are they've shown up on the FTP site at cs.uwp.edu.  In addition to
tons and tons of lyrics, there are discographies and other assorted
information on this site.  Read part V for more information.
    Besides, what are you talking about?  "Spewmatic" is an instrumental.

Q:  Where did Pearl Jam get their name?

    There are currently three versions of this story to my knowledge.

1)  The members of Pearl Jam are avid basketball fans, and early on the
band was named "Mookie Blaylock."  After Mookie and The NJ Nets
threatened to sue the band it was changed to Mookie's nicknamed
slamdunk, a "Pearl Jam".  "10", the title of Pearl Jam's first album, is
Mookie's jersey number.

2)  A Rolling Stone (Oct. 91?) article states that "Pearl Jam" was named
after a jelly that Eddy Vedder's grandma (Pearl) used to make for her
husband.  According to the article, the jam contained hallucinagens.

3)  The most persistant rumor I've heard that also happens to be the one
with the least documented evidence is that Pearl Jam is slang for semen.

Q:  What is the Negativland _U2_ record?

A:  The Negativland _U2_ single put out in late '91 by SST Records and
featured two tracks, both of which made fun of U2's "Still Haven't Found
What I'm Looking For".  Shortly after its release, an enormous legal
document arrived at SST from Island Records/ Warner-Chappel Publishing,
the gist of which was that SST was getting its butt sued for putting the
thing out.  Among the charges being levelled were that the packaging was
deceptive (this was reportedly the biggest problem that Island had with
the record), that
the use of various unauthorized samples on the single were copyright
infringement (Negativland maintained that as a piece of satire the
samples should have been allowed) and lots of other charges.
Incidentally, the "deceptive" packaging as that the single had "U2" in
huge letters on the front with "Negativland" in really small letters
across the bottom.  Island apparently felt that such packaging was
intended to deceive the consumer into believing it was a U2 release.

Anyway, SST and Negativland got squashed.  The settled out of court.
Total damages:  $90,000.  SST tried to get Negativland to pay the entire
bill while N'land offered to pay half.  No agreement was reached and
N'land left SST records, whose owner (Greg Ginn, ex-Black Flag
guitarist) threatened lawsuits.  Shortly thereafter Negativland put out
a CD and magazine combo entitled "The Letter U and the Numeral 2" which
documents the whole fiasco, including press releases, legal documents,
articles and everything else possibly concerned with the whole
situation.  Greg Ginn then threatened to sue N'land for, among other
thing, copyright infringement (the press releases were copyrighted, he
claims).  He also was suing over the fact that the magazine contained
such revelations as the fact that SST has gross sales in excess of $5
million.  As a result, "The Letter U and the Numeral 2" isn't available
right now either (sort of ironic, if you think about it).  That's the
current situation, I guess.

The music?  Oh yeah, the music.  Brilliant.  "Still Haven't Found..." is
thoroughly raked over the coals, with the Weatherman demolishing the
lyrics ("Yup, you're the fat one, and I want to be with you."), the band
playing the tune in amazingly goofy ways (or just humming it) and some
really choice Casey Kasem samples (ever wonder what it would sound like
if Casey Kasem said "Oh fuck!"?  Well...)  Find somebody who has a copy
and dub it.  Don't pay $100 (or more)  for it though, as that is
collector skumism at its best.  I was lucky enough to buy a copy when it
first came out
(as a matter of fact, it was the first N'land thing I bought..."Hmm,
I've heard about this band.  Maybe I'll buy this single, since it is the
only thing of theirs here in the store.") and would never consider
selling it.

Q:  What's the Mother Love Bone/Pearl Jam connection?

    Once upon a time, there was a pioneering Seattle grunge band called
Green River.  Steve Turner left the band early on, and was later joined
by Mark Arm to form Mudhoney.  The rest put together Mother Love Bone,
with Andrew Wood handling vocals, and "headed off on their way to Def
Lepperdom" as Barry Hennesler so aptly put it.  They band dissolved
after Andy's death from a heroin overdose.  The remaining members joined
Chris Cornell and Matt Cameron from Soundgarden in a tribute band called
"Project: Temple of the Dog," and these same Love Bone alumni have since
created the aforementioned Pearl Jam.

Q:  I bought Lilies, "In the Presence of Nothing" and noticed that the cd
cover listed one less song than is listed on my cd player track number
count. (I believe the track # count is correct) Can anyone explain the
discrepancy to me?

A:  Tracks 1-8 are as listed in order. Track 9 is called "Threw A Day" and
is from their 45. Track 10 is "Claire Hates Me."

Q:  What exactly is This Mortal Coil?

A:  This Mortal Coil was (note the was) the project of the founder of
4AD Records, Ivo Watts-Russel.  They produced three albums (_It'll End
In Tears_, _Filigree and Shadow_ and _Blood) along with a 12" ("Sixteen
Days"/"Gathering Dust") and a compilation track on _Lonely Is an
Eyesore_.  The project had, along with Watts-Russel, members of other
4AD bands (such as the Cocteau Twins, Dead Can Dance, The Wolfgang
Press, Colourbox, The Breeders, Modern English and others) as well as
non 4AD artists (Caroline Crawly, Cindytalk, Breathless, Alison Limerick
and others).  After _Blood_, Watts-Russel said that the project had gone
on long enough.  The three albums had been available only as imports in
the US up until February of 1993, when they were released in a box set
1991_.  This set also included a fourth
CD which contained most of the originals that the band covered over the
course of the three albums.

Q:  So, what exactly is "grunge"?

A:  Like any other word which attempts to describe an entire style of
music, the word "grunge" is mostly useless.  People use it in an attempt
to describe the recent flood of guitar driven acts who take riffs from
Black Sabbath and attitudes from punk.  People also mistakenly use it to
categorize all music out of Seattle, which is unfair to alot of very
good Seattle acts (and just try calling Diamond Fist Werny "grunge").
    There are many other terms such as "punk", "hardcore", "shoegazer",
"gothic", "industrial", "indie rock" and others which people use in an
attempt to say what it is they listen to (i.e. "I listen to mostly
gothic and industrial.  How about you?").  While these terms have a
limited usefulness in broad categorization (it's pretty safe to say that
a song categorized as "gothic" is not going to start with the drummer
yelling "one-two-three-four!"), try not to rely on them in describing
bands.  Saying a band relies on a pounding drum machine, various samples
from horror movies, sampled guitar and heavily distorted vocals is much
more descriptive than "industrial".  Above all, don't fret the
definitions too much.  Every person is going to have different
definitions of them, so don't let somebody calling a given band "grunge"
or "punk" or whatever turn you off of them (or onto them).

Q:  BLIND MELON SUCKS!

A:  Whatever.
    One of my pet peeves (and, evidently, one of Chris $L's, who
inspired this question) is people who post "reviews", such as the above
comment, which are completely devoid of anything resembling real
information.  Perhaps you do believe, in your heart of hearts, that Band
X sucks canal water or Band Y is a sell out.  Declaring that in front of
thousands of people will only convince said thousands that you are an
idiot.  There isn't anything wrong with disliking and album or band,
just try to state your opinions intelligently.  Do a trash review, but
explain yourself.  Saying "Band X resorts to overplayed cliches in the
boring, overlong songs which proliferate on _Liquid Drano_, causing them
to have all the distinction in my mind of tile grout" is much more
useful than "Band X sucks!".

Q:  Where can I get the _Valley Girl_ soundtrack?

A:  This information comes from Goldmine, which is usually fairly
accurate (although their discographies are sometimes sort of spotty):

Epic Records stated that the album was slated for release in the US,
but an actual release never happened due to contractual difficulties. They
deny that any copies were ever pressed or issued in any way.  Thus, a
full soundtrack to the album never saw the light of day.

Despite this, some copies of subsets of the soundtrack were issued.  A
10-song album came out in the UK on Avatar Records, while a 6-song
mini-album later came out on Roadshow Records.  Neither of these
releases contains anything remotely approaching rare, nor was anything
particularly rare used in the movie.  Also provided with the article is
a list of all the songs used in the movie along with sources.  It
shouldn't be too difficult to comb used bins (and friends' collections)
to assemble your own Valley Girl soundtrack:

Bananarama & Fun Boy Three: 'He Was Really Saying Something'
  Deep Sea Skiving (Chrysalis)
The Clash: 'Rock the Casbah'
  Combat Rock (Epic)
Josie Cotton: 'He Could Be the One' and 'Johnny are you Queer?'
  Convertible Music (Elektra)
Josie Cotton: 'School is In'
  From the Hip (Elektra)
Culture Club: 'Do You Really Want to Hurt Me?'
  Kissing to Be Clever (Virgin/Epic)
Felony: 'The Fanatic'
  The Fanatic (Rock&Roll/Scotti Brothers)
The Flirts: '(Don't Put Another Dime)'
  10 Cents a Dance (O Records)
Eddy Grant: 'Electric Avenue'
  Killer on the Rampage (Portrait)
Bonnie Hayes and the Wild Combo: 'Girls Like Me' and 'Shelly's Boyfriend'
  Good Clean Fun (Slash)
The Jam: 'Town Called Malice'
  The Gift (Polydor)
Men at Work: 'Who Can it Be Now?'
  Business as Usual (Columbia)
Modern English: 'I Melt With You'
  After the Snow (Sire)
Gary Myrick: 'Time to Win'
  Language (Epic)
Gary Myrick and the Figures: 'She Talks in Stereo'
  Gary Myrick and the Figures (Epic)
Payolas: 'Eyes of a Stranger'
  No Stranger to Danger (A&M)
The Plimsouls: 'A Million Miles Away', 'Oldest Story in the World',
               'Everywhere at Once'
  Everywhere at Once (Geffen)
Psychadelic Furs: 'Love My Way'
  Forever Now (Columbia)
Sparks: 'Angst in my Pants' and 'Eaten by the Monster of Love'
  Angst in my Pants (Atlantic)
Pat Travers: 'I La La La Love You'
  Black Pearl (Polygram)

Most of the above tracks are still quite easily available on CD, so look
around and make your own soundtrack before shelling out tons of money
for one of the rare released ones.

Q:  Can anybody explain the personnel changes of the Throwing Muses to me?

A:  I can't, but K. Lena Bennett (who, along with the various members
of the Indie List Junta, past and present, have been the few helpful
and supportive people out there with respect to this here FAQ file, and
who collectively earn my thanks...especially K. Lena Bennett, Sean
Murphy and Mark Cornick) can.  She says (quoting somebody else):

": Anyway, Kristin Hersh (sorry if I'm spelling it wrong) and David Narcizo
: (drummer) have been in the band since its inception and still continue.
: Leslie Langston (bassist) left after Hunkpapa.  Tanya Donnelly left after
: The Real Ramona.  Fred Abong was the bassist on The Real Ramona, but he
: left and was replaced by Bernard Georges (altho Leslie Langston played
: bass on Red Heaven, altho was not considered part of the group - the
: photo features only Hersh and Narcizo).  Kristin Hersh is releasing a
: solo album but continues to play with Throwing Muses (which I'm assuming
: now consists of Hersh, Narcizo, and Georges).

Sorry to quote back everything, but everything you said was correct (down to
the spelling of Hersh's name!) There was another bassist (Elaine Adamedes) who
is only on their '84 demo and an '85 7" ep. (not their 2nd demo)"

Q:  Hey, anybody who watches MTV is obviously a total bozo.  Plus,
Beavis and Butthead are truly moronic and anybody who enjoys them is
doubly so.

A:  This isn't a question, but is instead a frequently seen comment on
alt.music.alternative.  "Is MTV, in any way, alternative?" is the
question that such comments seem to be really asking.  There isn't a
good answer for this.  For some areas that lack an active music scene or
a good college radio station, programs such as 120 Minutes and
Alternative Nation represent one of the few outlets for hearing new
music.  For people living in such areas, this music may very well be
alternative.  For others lucky enough to be blessed with active scenes
or good radio stations, MTV may be completely commercial pap.  It
depends mainly on one's perspective and tastes.  As such, discussions on
the worth of MTV are invariably going to be inconclusive.  Don't bother.
 I will, however, state that if you have access to Usenet in the first
place, you've got a fairly good musical resource at hand and you should
be able to avoid relying entirely on MTV for your musical information.
Try subscribing to some mailing lists, and ask around for the addresses
of some good 'zines.  You'd be surprised how much one can find out about
music in a very short period of time.
    Beavis and Butthead have recently, and inexplicably, become quite a
popular topic of "conversation" on alt.music.alternative.  Like 'em or
not, don't bother discussing them on a.m.a.  You're not going to change
anyone's opinion on them and you're just going to incite a pointless
flamewar.  Besides, last time I checked, they were a cartoon, not a
musical group.

Q:  Where are some good places to find out more about music?

A:  Well, Usenet is not an ideal place for real information, but
occasionally some real information leaks through.  There are quite a
number of Usenet groups dedicated to music.  The easiest way to find out
abouo.  Besides stuff
like discographies, concert listings and whatnot, listings of musical
resources available on Usenet and by FTP get posted to rec.music.info.
It's very low volume and can be helpful at times.
    Besides Usenet, you can try mailing lists.  See part IV for more
information on that.  Aside from computer resources, you can try print
media.  There are magazines like Alternative Press, Option and others
that attempt to cover mainly alternative music.  In addition to these
mass media sources, there are "'zines" which are put out by regular
people just like you and me.  Although they are often spotty they also
tend to be alot more honest than their mass media counterparts which
have to appease their advertisers.  The main thing is to keep your eyes
(and your ears) open.

Q:  Thanks, you've been helpful.  Anything you want to add?

A:  That's mighty gracious of you, even though it was really me who
typed that.  Well, gosh, I guess there isn't too much to say.  If you
have anything you would like to see in this section, go ahead and email
me at [e-mail].

Joshua Buergel - [e-mail] - [e-mail]
"In a report in a recent issue of Audubon magazine, Ursula Garza de
Garza of the border town of Matamoros, Mexico mentioned that her dogs no
longer have a flea problem.  'We grab the dogs and stick them in the
canal [that connects several Matamoros chemical companies], and the
fleas are gone.  All the hair falls off, too, but it gradually comes
back.'" - News of the Wierd, March 11, 1994